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"Forgiving your 'giver'; a question; 'migration' of sores"

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Pariah Jan-20-00, 08:34 PM (CST)

"Forgiving your 'giver'; a question; 'migration' of sores"

I have used the words 'giver' and 'donor' to denote the individual who gave me HSVI of the genitals on New Year's Eve. I don't know what else to call him--Mr. Cold Sore? Herpes Man?
Some will take exception to the snide underpinnings of those names, given that so many Americans carry HSVI of the oral area. I am not trying to offend <you>, but rather vent some steam, for I am hurt and very confused, and ultimately as much to blame as he is. Still, he kind of repulses me.
I read TinMan's post on another thread dealing with this topic, and he said that he held the girl who gave it to him and forgave her, as she was distraught. CSM was distraught also, and for about a week, as I pussyfooted around the diagnosis, knowing what I had but so reluctant to confirm it, I hung out with him at his place before work. He tried to get physical with me, but I was running a low-grade fever, had serious malaise and creeping depression, and those raging sores on my perineum. I didn't WANT to be held. And since I found out what those sores were exactly a week ago today, I have not cared to be touched for very different reasons. The problem is, I cannot articulate them.
A mutual acquaintence--his friend--whom he has known for two years took it upon herself to tell me exactly how upset he was last night. I felt really bad as she relayed this information, and bad again tonight when he didn't call as he had been doing to have coffee and take me to work, yet I didn't call him. I think I was trying to solidify the break/convince him of how ruined I really feel, despite all of the info we have both taken in/get him down on his knees, for some unintelligible reason. I do forgive him, I think--and I miss having him around, but I don't want him touching me. I don't think this is all that unrealistic at this stage (ppl in this lab are virtually YELLING and really pissing me off..do not have own puter and must use university's). My emotions are almost everywhere at once. I think I may be using what happened to predefine the break that will inevitably occur once his foreign female friend arrives stateside. That may never happen, but in my mind, it already has.
Second qx: I assume I now have antibodies to HSVI circulating, which would mean that I could kiss someone with latent cold sores--virus shedding, crawling on the lips without producing visible evidence of its existence--and not get them. Is this so? I never had cold sores, so I hadn't considered this aspect of virus transmission. Also, would not the person with HSVI of the oral area have circulating antibodies and thus not have to worry about contracting HSVI of the genitals in the case of oral sex...
Since my sores were/are on the perineum (area between vagina/penis and rectum), is it possible for them to creep up to the vagina on their own? I have been inspecting my privates for visual signs that this has happened, as I have/imagine that I have a vague itch there that doesn't feel a thing like the yeast infection that I do have. I keep waiting for them to pop up in the cravices between the labia, but see nothing.
Also, can i shave the perineum once the sores have gone away? I am pretty hairy back there, had shaved the night before I got this, and even though sex is out of the question, see the hair back there and still feel like an ape and would like to see it clean once again. But i do not want those fucking sores to come back. Anything. Anything but that.
I am so fucking lonely.
Pariah

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Table of contents

RE: Tony, Laurie, Jan-20-00, (1)
she beat me to it, Keyser Soze, Jan-20-00, (2)
quickly....healing,, Tinman, Jan-21-00, (7)
yup, yup, yup, Sal, Jan-20-00, (3)
RE: Forgiving your 'giver'; aB ques..., windy, Jan-20-00, (4)
RE: Forgiving your 'giver'; aB ques..., Katkin, Jan-21-00, (5)
sorry, , windy, Jan-21-00, (6)

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Laurie Jan-20-00, 08:56 PM (CST)

1. "RE: Tony"

Tony (Tinman) is really something special. Remember what you said Pariah? We all have different emotional makeups. What isn't a big deal to some of us is a huge deal to others. Just remember, while herpes is a drop in the bucket for some of us, things that you manage to take in stride might well throw us upside down and inside out.
It's good to be healing, emotionally, enough to forgive. And yes, the guilt of the giver is often much greater than the stress of the receiver (hard to imagine, I know) but again -- that depends on the emotional makeup of the individual. While it is good to see he has a conscious, he is being selfish to want to rush you to forgiveness. Course, I'm not there, I don't see your exchanges, but it seems you have indicated you might want some physical if not actual and emotional distance for a while. You might have to lay it on the line, just tell him, you miss him and you think you want to maintain the friendship but you need some space and time to come to terms with this as best you can. It's great to have someone support you, acknowledge it but beyond explaining it in simple terms you don't owe him anything.
It sucks all around, but you've come a very long way in a very short time. Maybe all he needs is for you to acknowledge HIS feelings -- not realizing that just as he can't imagine what YOU must be going through you really can't imagine the feeling of just having given this to someone.
And this other relationship, if it's a factor, a little time and space won't hurt one bit to help you work through that one mentally. He has to know there's an issue there -- what are you supposed to do, ignore it?
Hang in... just talk to your friend, make it short and sweet, and then focus on yourself.

Top

Keyser Soze Jan-20-00, 09:08 PM (CST)

2. "she beat me to it"

I agree with Laurie 100%: he needs to recognize your need for space. And space doesn't mean the end of your relationship.
Shaving: I would recommend waiting until you're fully healed and then do it very carefully. Any trauma to that region could result in another outbreak. One thing to keep in mind is that a majority of people with HSV1 genitally don't ever have another outbreak. I hope that you are one of these.
hugs,
KS

Top

Tinman Jan-21-00, 06:06 PM (CST)

7. "quickly....healing,"

takes some time, different times for different people, be easy on yourself, and although the urge may be there, if he is truly remorseful, dont be too hard on him. If there was something developing before try not to snuff it out. He does need some, a little affection. tell him you need some time.
thanks ladies for the compliments....
and actually, shhhhhh!!!!!! dont tell anyone, but i never forgave my giver because i never blamed her, never will.
got to run.....got a hot, hot, oh so hot date!!
sdr&r
tony

Top

Sal Jan-20-00, 10:25 PM (CST)

3. "yup, yup, yup"

Hi PC,
Yep - Ironic isn't it?
So many people carry HVS 1 - yet somehow you've managed, likely because of careful personal habits from your early childhood on, to avoid catching a cold sore in grade school.
You and increasingly more people I believe. I think that's the reason why it's said about 30% of new genital herpes cases are caused by HVS 1. They have no previous immunity.
The good news is just as you say - you'll now have immunity.
It will be very difficult for you to catch oral HSV1. You'll probably never have a coldsore on your face. On the other hand, if you had caught it from a kiss - you might have, given HSV 1's proclivity to the oral region. - You might have even had frequent re-occurances.
I guess you could call that one of this cloud's silver linings.
You still may have a re-occurances - but they will be less severe, less frequent, and even in this 'worst case senario' - will most likely expire in a few years.
But there's more!
Odds are, a future lover will already have been exposed to HSV1.
Some may know (that they have had a cold sore) - but lots of others have carried the antibodies since childhood, and may not recall ever having had an outbreak. They can be tested, even without an outbreak present to be sure - but as well - you will not be as contagious as those who have frequent outbreaks at the viruses' prefered site, because frequent outbreaks are corrolated with frequent shedding.
About the virus moving - it 'creeps", sure. - but it actually happens through the nerve passages - and as I understand it, the general migration is towards the buttocks. There is not a whole lot about this in the literature, and some people do report that even after time - it can reoccur at various sites along the way - not necessarily in any particular order. After your primary, though, it's unlikely you'd autoinnoculate another site.
Even though it seems clear you're not rushing off into another relationship, All the above comes with a word of caution. Becareful of live sores, and, give your body time to develop full immunity.

Love,
Sal
PS - Sounds like you've found this already - but just incase :
http://www.herpes.com/hsv1-2.html

Top

windy Jan-20-00, 11:37 PM (CST)

4. "RE: Forgiving your 'giver'; aB question; 'migration' of sores"

PC,
I'll go for the technical questions for ten points, please. BTW, I think the name "Mr. Cold Sore" is just fine.
About forgiveness and desires - It was much easier for me to forgive my donor, who informed me in advance, than it has been for me to forgive myself for being a donor who didn't inform in advance (due to a combination of ignorance and brain-in-dick syndrome). When I got herpes, the desire for sex returned pretty soon after the outbreak cleared, but when I gave it, I felt much worse for much longer, couldn't even think about sex without feeling sick, and still can't bring myself to describe all the thoughts and feelings that went with that.
Had I been an uninformed recipient or an informing donor, I'm sure I'd feel a lot differenly about each of those incidents. So I guess I'm saying that it depends on the circumstances. And what lisx wrote makes sense to me for your situation.
Once your body builds a full immune response to this, you'll be very unlikely to ever get a cold sore on your mouth. Just don't kiss someone with an active sore.
Likewise, anyone who has HSV1 antibodies is unlikely to get it from you, either by performing oral sex on you or by having intercourse with you.
Herpes can come out anywhere in the area supplied by the infected nerves. That doesn't mean that it will.
I've never shaved my affected area, so I'll skip that question.
Take care,
windy

Top

Katkin Jan-21-00, 03:13 AM (CST)

5. "RE: Forgiving your 'giver'; aB question; 'migration' of sores"

Well after ten months of having HSV 2 ( I also have Herpes 1 but have never had a coldsore; I was tested for everything including the IgM thing)...I am now having a turn around in thought, of not so much forgiving the 'giver' but forgiving myself. I think the worst pain is the emotional pain we put ourselves through. What the hell are we punishing ourselves for ? Now more than ever is the time to get in touch with our bodies and take care of ourselves. I believe THAT to be the most important thing ; physically and emotionally.
I have also heard very positive info that HSV 1 is less likely to recur genitally, but I do not think that we can generalise. Depending upon your immune system, it behaves differently in everyone.
I have also been a bit confused about the whole 'migration' thing.....but one thing I am clear on, is that 'yes' you can get an OB in a different area along the same nerve path where the initial exposure/transmission occurred.
My latest OB was about an inch from the original site...tender but no blister/lesion.
What I would like to know more about is, once you have HSV 1 or 2 or both (as i do)....can you 'catch' it elsewhere, i.e during oral sex ?
and be reinfected elsewhere ??
There is alot of conflicting information on that one.

Top

windy Jan-21-00, 05:49 AM (CST)

6. "sorry, "

I meant laurie, not lisx.
w (air-head)

Top

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Pariah	Jan-20-00, 08:34 PM (CST)
"Forgiving your 'giver'; a question; 'migration' of sores"
I have used the words 'giver' and 'donor' to denote the individual who gave me HSVI of the genitals on New Year's Eve. I don't know what else to call him--Mr. Cold Sore? Herpes Man? Some will take exception to the snide underpinnings of those names, given that so many Americans carry HSVI of the oral area. I am not trying to offend <you>, but rather vent some steam, for I am hurt and very confused, and ultimately as much to blame as he is. Still, he kind of repulses me. I read TinMan's post on another thread dealing with this topic, and he said that he held the girl who gave it to him and forgave her, as she was distraught. CSM was distraught also, and for about a week, as I pussyfooted around the diagnosis, knowing what I had but so reluctant to confirm it, I hung out with him at his place before work. He tried to get physical with me, but I was running a low-grade fever, had serious malaise and creeping depression, and those raging sores on my perineum. I didn't WANT to be held. And since I found out what those sores were exactly a week ago today, I have not cared to be touched for very different reasons. The problem is, I cannot articulate them. A mutual acquaintence--his friend--whom he has known for two years took it upon herself to tell me exactly how upset he was last night. I felt really bad as she relayed this information, and bad again tonight when he didn't call as he had been doing to have coffee and take me to work, yet I didn't call him. I think I was trying to solidify the break/convince him of how ruined I really feel, despite all of the info we have both taken in/get him down on his knees, for some unintelligible reason. I do forgive him, I think--and I miss having him around, but I don't want him touching me. I don't think this is all that unrealistic at this stage (ppl in this lab are virtually YELLING and really pissing me off..do not have own puter and must use university's). My emotions are almost everywhere at once. I think I may be using what happened to predefine the break that will inevitably occur once his foreign female friend arrives stateside. That may never happen, but in my mind, it already has. Second qx: I assume I now have antibodies to HSVI circulating, which would mean that I could kiss someone with latent cold sores--virus shedding, crawling on the lips without producing visible evidence of its existence--and not get them. Is this so? I never had cold sores, so I hadn't considered this aspect of virus transmission. Also, would not the person with HSVI of the oral area have circulating antibodies and thus not have to worry about contracting HSVI of the genitals in the case of oral sex... Since my sores were/are on the perineum (area between vagina/penis and rectum), is it possible for them to creep up to the vagina on their own? I have been inspecting my privates for visual signs that this has happened, as I have/imagine that I have a vague itch there that doesn't feel a thing like the yeast infection that I do have. I keep waiting for them to pop up in the cravices between the labia, but see nothing. Also, can i shave the perineum once the sores have gone away? I am pretty hairy back there, had shaved the night before I got this, and even though sex is out of the question, see the hair back there and still feel like an ape and would like to see it clean once again. But i do not want those fucking sores to come back. Anything. Anything but that. I am so fucking lonely. Pariah
	Top

Laurie	Jan-20-00, 08:56 PM (CST)
1. "RE: Tony"
Tony (Tinman) is really something special. Remember what you said Pariah? We all have different emotional makeups. What isn't a big deal to some of us is a huge deal to others. Just remember, while herpes is a drop in the bucket for some of us, things that you manage to take in stride might well throw us upside down and inside out. It's good to be healing, emotionally, enough to forgive. And yes, the guilt of the giver is often much greater than the stress of the receiver (hard to imagine, I know) but again -- that depends on the emotional makeup of the individual. While it is good to see he has a conscious, he is being selfish to want to rush you to forgiveness. Course, I'm not there, I don't see your exchanges, but it seems you have indicated you might want some physical if not actual and emotional distance for a while. You might have to lay it on the line, just tell him, you miss him and you think you want to maintain the friendship but you need some space and time to come to terms with this as best you can. It's great to have someone support you, acknowledge it but beyond explaining it in simple terms you don't owe him anything. It sucks all around, but you've come a very long way in a very short time. Maybe all he needs is for you to acknowledge HIS feelings -- not realizing that just as he can't imagine what YOU must be going through you really can't imagine the feeling of just having given this to someone. And this other relationship, if it's a factor, a little time and space won't hurt one bit to help you work through that one mentally. He has to know there's an issue there -- what are you supposed to do, ignore it? Hang in... just talk to your friend, make it short and sweet, and then focus on yourself.
	Top


	Keyser Soze	Jan-20-00, 09:08 PM (CST)
	2. "she beat me to it"
	I agree with Laurie 100%: he needs to recognize your need for space. And space doesn't mean the end of your relationship. Shaving: I would recommend waiting until you're fully healed and then do it very carefully. Any trauma to that region could result in another outbreak. One thing to keep in mind is that a majority of people with HSV1 genitally don't ever have another outbreak. I hope that you are one of these. hugs, KS
		Top


	Tinman	Jan-21-00, 06:06 PM (CST)
	7. "quickly....healing,"
	takes some time, different times for different people, be easy on yourself, and although the urge may be there, if he is truly remorseful, dont be too hard on him. If there was something developing before try not to snuff it out. He does need some, a little affection. tell him you need some time. thanks ladies for the compliments.... and actually, shhhhhh!!!!!! dont tell anyone, but i never forgave my giver because i never blamed her, never will. got to run.....got a hot, hot, oh so hot date!! sdr&r tony
		Top

Sal	Jan-20-00, 10:25 PM (CST)
3. "yup, yup, yup"
Hi PC, Yep - Ironic isn't it? So many people carry HVS 1 - yet somehow you've managed, likely because of careful personal habits from your early childhood on, to avoid catching a cold sore in grade school. You and increasingly more people I believe. I think that's the reason why it's said about 30% of new genital herpes cases are caused by HVS 1. They have no previous immunity. The good news is just as you say - you'll now have immunity. It will be very difficult for you to catch oral HSV1. You'll probably never have a coldsore on your face. On the other hand, if you had caught it from a kiss - you might have, given HSV 1's proclivity to the oral region. - You might have even had frequent re-occurances. I guess you could call that one of this cloud's silver linings. You still may have a re-occurances - but they will be less severe, less frequent, and even in this 'worst case senario' - will most likely expire in a few years. But there's more! Odds are, a future lover will already have been exposed to HSV1. Some may know (that they have had a cold sore) - but lots of others have carried the antibodies since childhood, and may not recall ever having had an outbreak. They can be tested, even without an outbreak present to be sure - but as well - you will not be as contagious as those who have frequent outbreaks at the viruses' prefered site, because frequent outbreaks are corrolated with frequent shedding. About the virus moving - it 'creeps", sure. - but it actually happens through the nerve passages - and as I understand it, the general migration is towards the buttocks. There is not a whole lot about this in the literature, and some people do report that even after time - it can reoccur at various sites along the way - not necessarily in any particular order. After your primary, though, it's unlikely you'd autoinnoculate another site. Even though it seems clear you're not rushing off into another relationship, All the above comes with a word of caution. Becareful of live sores, and, give your body time to develop full immunity. Love, Sal PS - Sounds like you've found this already - but just incase : http://www.herpes.com/hsv1-2.html
	Top

windy	Jan-20-00, 11:37 PM (CST)
4. "RE: Forgiving your 'giver'; aB question; 'migration' of sores"
PC, I'll go for the technical questions for ten points, please. BTW, I think the name "Mr. Cold Sore" is just fine. About forgiveness and desires - It was much easier for me to forgive my donor, who informed me in advance, than it has been for me to forgive myself for being a donor who didn't inform in advance (due to a combination of ignorance and brain-in-dick syndrome). When I got herpes, the desire for sex returned pretty soon after the outbreak cleared, but when I gave it, I felt much worse for much longer, couldn't even think about sex without feeling sick, and still can't bring myself to describe all the thoughts and feelings that went with that. Had I been an uninformed recipient or an informing donor, I'm sure I'd feel a lot differenly about each of those incidents. So I guess I'm saying that it depends on the circumstances. And what lisx wrote makes sense to me for your situation. Once your body builds a full immune response to this, you'll be very unlikely to ever get a cold sore on your mouth. Just don't kiss someone with an active sore. Likewise, anyone who has HSV1 antibodies is unlikely to get it from you, either by performing oral sex on you or by having intercourse with you. Herpes can come out anywhere in the area supplied by the infected nerves. That doesn't mean that it will. I've never shaved my affected area, so I'll skip that question. Take care, windy
	Top


	Katkin	Jan-21-00, 03:13 AM (CST)
	5. "RE: Forgiving your 'giver'; aB question; 'migration' of sores"
	Well after ten months of having HSV 2 ( I also have Herpes 1 but have never had a coldsore; I was tested for everything including the IgM thing)...I am now having a turn around in thought, of not so much forgiving the 'giver' but forgiving myself. I think the worst pain is the emotional pain we put ourselves through. What the hell are we punishing ourselves for ? Now more than ever is the time to get in touch with our bodies and take care of ourselves. I believe THAT to be the most important thing ; physically and emotionally. I have also heard very positive info that HSV 1 is less likely to recur genitally, but I do not think that we can generalise. Depending upon your immune system, it behaves differently in everyone. I have also been a bit confused about the whole 'migration' thing.....but one thing I am clear on, is that 'yes' you can get an OB in a different area along the same nerve path where the initial exposure/transmission occurred. My latest OB was about an inch from the original site...tender but no blister/lesion. What I would like to know more about is, once you have HSV 1 or 2 or both (as i do)....can you 'catch' it elsewhere, i.e during oral sex ? and be reinfected elsewhere ?? There is alot of conflicting information on that one.
		Top


	windy	Jan-21-00, 05:49 AM (CST)
	6. "sorry, "
	I meant laurie, not lisx. w (air-head)
		Top

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